MODIFY CATALOG France 100 francs 1986 Statue of Liberty piedfort mintage [solved]

Hello.   The listing for the France 100 F piedfort Statue of Liberty silver coin(s) needs attention.  It currently shows only the proof version.  There were an additional 250,000 uncirculated specimens struck.  This needs to be added.   Numerous sources keep referring to unc. specimens as “rare - only 5,000 struck” - because the only info shown is for the proofs.   This practice is widespread and is counter-informative.  Numista needs to set the record straight.   TC

Please always include links to items being discussed. Make it easier for others to find the coin.

From what you say I think you are talking about N#25529 but that is listed as a pattern.

Yes, that is the category.  The “pattern” classification is - in my opinion - incorrect.   TC

KM# P972 in SCWC.  P denotes piedfort.  A pattern would be KM# Pn…

Piedforts are listed as coin type Pattern in Numista catalog.

Hello.  The Numista listing (incorrectly) shows (classifies) the 5000 proofs on the Search the coin catalog (results)  page AND the following page in the Features block  - type - as “pattern”.  Again, I believe this to be incorrect.  TC

To clarify, there are actually 2 issues here.

1.  The 250,000 uncirculated mintage is missing - and needs to be inserted.

2.  The type classification of “pattern” needs to be revised.

TC

Revise the type classification to what?

Not pattern.  I don't have a list of other choices in front of me.  Even leaving it blank is better.

The 250,000 unc. strikes have historically traded as bullion.  TC

Most every other piedfort coin in the catalog is Type: Pattern as the guidelines state.  Perhaps Non-circulating coin would be better for this one piedfort?

If you look at the other 100 f coins of the period - gold, platinum, palladium, - “Non circulating coin” is used (but not consistently).  

Thanks for sharing the guidelines.  I disagree with putting piedforts in the same category as patterns - they are somewhat a category of their own. If piedfort was removed and essai inserted, that would make more sense.  But I digress - ooops.   TC

Do you have a source indicating 250 000 additional silver Piedforts were made?

TMichael@aimmedia.com    laurent.voitel@cgb.fr  

That does not answer a question really.

I quite seriously doubt French would make 250 000 Piedforts, when usually there are maximum few hundreds made. I would close the topic if there is no source about this.

Maybe is it possible that you meant this coin? N#29 But I have no idea where that number came from though.

Hello.  The mintage for proofs is 5,000 - shown on the C. o A. in the 1986 2 pc. set (Proof + Unc.)  The mintage of the unc.  is not shown.

I have done some research to validate my suspicion that the unc. coins were minted in much greater numbers.  This unc. coin was marketed 

soon after release as a bullion coin - available through Blanchard and - later - APMEX in bulk quantities.  The yellow 8 pc. tubes are occasionally seen on eBay and other sites.  I am positive that 250,000 pieces were struck.  Monnaie de Paris has not responded to my inquiries - but apparently they aren't very cooperative about such things. Stay tuned ………..  TC

Hello again.  Check the piedfort mintages for the 1987 LaFayette coins.  TC

Hello again.  My reliable source(s) indicate 50,000 proof piedforts and 100,000 unc. piedforts - confirmed by C.o.A. in 2 pc. set.  Again, Numista does not show any unc. coins minted.  

OOOOOPS - my bad.  Numista shows 100,000 unc. LaFayette coins struck.  No proof piedfort mintage shown.  TC

tcmusic11

SCWC backs up these mintage numbers and the different composition for this 1987 coin.  They only mention the 5,000 for the 1986 coin.

Hello again..  As I wrote earlier, there is no mention of the mintage on the C.o.A. in the 1986 piedfort set.  One of my sources is a senior editor with NumisMaster and has other credentials including contributor to World Coin News.  The other source is a modern coin specialist with CGB Numismatics in Paris - one of the largest numismatic companies in the country.    TC

Photo shown is one of 250,000 circulation strike piedfort coins struck.

So ……………………….  how much more documentation is needed ?  TC

Asked a referee to add a line/check this.

I'm not sure how are supposed to differentiate Proof from basic Piedfort but we would have saved time if you just shared a link to begin with instead of invoking oral sources :-)

https://www.cgb.fr/piefort-argent-de-100-francs-liberte-statue-de-la-1986-paris-f-454-2p-spl,v16_1877,a.html

Hello again.   What about the 1987 LaFayette 100 franc PIEDFORT PROOF coins ?   None currently listed in Numista. There is a photo of the 1987 C. o. A. above.  Shows 50,000 minted.  TC

tcmusic11

Hello again.   What about the 1987 LaFayette 100 franc PIEDFORT PROOF coins ?   None currently listed in Numista. There is a photo of the 1987 C. o. A. above.  Shows 50,000 minted.  TC

That would require a new Numista coin page.

Yes, weight and fineness differ

Weight's the same. Silver content weight is different.

rsirian1

Weight's the same. Silver content weight is different.

Yes indeed

Hello.  I can not find a listing for the France 1987 100 francs LaFayette PROOF PIEDFORT coin anywhere in the catalog.  New page or otherwise.  It should be added  somewhere .   TC

MONNAIE DE PARIS 1987 GENERAL LA FAYETTE SILVER 100 FRANCS TWO COIN SET | eBay

1987 FRANCE SILVER 100 FRANCS PIEFORT GENERAL LAFAYETTE NGC PF 69 ULTRA CAMEO | eBay

tcmusic11

Hello.  I can not find a listing for the France 1987 100 francs LaFayette PROOF PIEDFORT coin anywhere in the catalog.  New page or otherwise.  It should be added  somewhere .   TC

 

MONNAIE DE PARIS 1987 GENERAL LA FAYETTE SILVER 100 FRANCS TWO COIN SET | eBay

 

1987 FRANCE SILVER 100 FRANCS PIEFORT GENERAL LAFAYETTE NGC PF 69 ULTRA CAMEO | eBay

 

 

Then you need to request a new page creation. 

You can use the duplicate feature below an existing page comparable and then update all different fields