Israel: ½ lira 1963 / 5723, km36.1, small and large animals [solved]

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces1031.html

Ole

Is it always 1 sheep for Tel Aviv, and 2 sheep for Bern?

Also, Switzerland is abbreviated as CH, for Confœderatio Helvetica.

Thanks, I have corrected it



Ole

I'm not sure if the description (small/large) is accurate, the size looks the same, but certainly it's a weak strike for coins minted in Tel Aviv.

In a certain way I think you're right, BUT the bases of the memorahs do NOT have the same size:



What do you conclude?

Ole

I suppose the pictures has been made at the same resolution. In this case there is indeed a difference in size also but as far as I can see the difference is very small (few pixels from photo). Is this difference in size easy to catch with the eyes or it would be more easy to check the weak or strong strike of the coin to get these varieties? What about the upper part of menorah? The size is still different between Tel Aviv and Bern?

Edit: I took a look at my 1/2 lira coins and they are indeed slightly different in size, anyway at first look it's pretty hard to say if menorah's base is larger or smaller but the strike I think it's pretty obvious and might be a better criteria

So something like this?
Ole

Looks better. It's more intuitive in my opinion and describe the varieties better. Ordinary people won't observe the size first but the weak strike. So it's more safe to aware them about both differences: in size and strike.

PS: it's menorah not memorah

Hi,

would this be OK?



Ole

Looks good Ole. Thanks for sharing all these varieties with us.

PS: wouldn't be a good idea to ask Xavior to create a forum section where we can have all these varieties documented and grouped by continent or countries? It could be more useful than just adding the documentation as a comment for a specific coin.

Xavier doesn't seem to share our opinion about that....

Take care
Ole

That's a shame. It's like when you have a nice ruby but you decide to cut it in many smaller pieces.

Have you had a look at this? Since you're interested in Isralean coins you might have an idea?

https://en.numista.com/forum/topic88777.html

Thanks for having a look and eventually finding the answer.

Ole

Hi Ole,

I'm a collector of Israel coins from 1927 up to 1980 and now and then I'm looking for good pictures that show the differences between the 1 and 1/2 Lira 1963 small/large animals because the Haffner catalogs have very bad pictures. That is how I found your pictures on Numista.

They are by far the clearest pictures, however, I have some questions. The pictures of the 1/2 Lira and the 1 Lira are from exactly the same coins. It is not clear which is the 1/2 Lira or the 1 Lira. Are these your own pictures? Can you shed any light on this?

I'm asking because the 1963 1/2 Lira small animals mintage is very low compared to the large animals variety. However, if you look on eBay at the 1963 1/2 Lira coins offered, they appear to me to be the small animal variety. Even if they are offered as large, the differences are hardly recognizable if possible at all.
Besides that, I have in total 3 1963 1/2 Lira coins and they are all the small animal variety. I bought them on cheap markets over a 20/25 year period of time. Then to have only the small animal variety is against the odds.

Regards,

Tom Vreeken.

Quote: "dukaat53"​Hi Ole,
​
​I'm a collector of Israel coins from 1927 up to 1980 and now and then I'm looking for good pictures that show the differences between the 1 and 1/2 Lira 1963 small/large animals because the Haffner catalogs have very bad pictures. That is how I found your pictures on Numista.
​
​They are by far the clearest pictures, however, I have some questions. The pictures of the 1/2 Lira and the 1 Lira are from exactly the same coins. It is not clear which is the 1/2 Lira or the 1 Lira. Are these your own pictures? Can you shed any light on this?
​
​I'm asking because the 1963 1/2 Lira small animals mintage is very low compared to the large animals variety. However, if you look on eBay at the 1963 1/2 Lira coins offered, they appear to me to be the small animal variety. Even if they are offered as large, the differences are hardly recognizable if possible at all.
​Besides that, I have in total 3 1963 1/2 Lira coins and they are all the small animal variety. I bought them on cheap markets over a 20/25 year period of time. Then to have only the small animal variety is against the odds.
​
​Regards,
​
​Tom Vreeken.
​
​

​Hi Tom,

The 1/2 lira of both types I have in my collection, but the images are from a French documentation, yes I have the permission to use it!

The 1 lira was documented by the same French guy, and he obviously used the same images for both documentations, and my English version as well. I only have the detailed version in my collection, but not the weak strike version.

If you want to, I can make the images of my 3 coins?

Groeten
Ole

Hi Ole,

That's great, I'm looking forward to it with interest!

Regards,

Tom.

Hi Tom,

I'm sorry but my 2 1/2 lira coins are extremely similar, both large animals?

The large, as original thought!


And here the "small", which is obviously also large!



The 1 lira coin with large animals?



Take care

Ole

Hi Ole,

Nice to see them. To me, they all appear somewhere in between 'large' and 'small'.
That is my exact problem, so far I did not find any pictures that without a doubt showed me the differences between the large and small animals. Even not with your pictures, because the same pictures are used for the 1/2 and 1 Lira coins. However, I have understood that this is a controversial subject among Israeli collectors too. I will let you know more about this.

Well, here are my 1/2 Lira 1963 coins, in my opinion somewhere between large and small  :







About your 1 Lira coin, it has a filled 'R' in ISRAEL, that's a die-break.
And there are two different types of it (apart from the die-break). You have to find two more of them.
The most difficult to find you have already, because of the die-break!
I will post more about it soon in your other post about the 1 Lira 1963 topic.

Tom.