Plate money

Hello! Today I will talk about plate money. If anyone does not know what "plate money" is, they are giant coins. Plate money was popular during the 17th and 18th centuries, and it was minted in Sweden and Russia. Plate money was minted from copper, or other cheaper metals.

Sweden

3 Öre Kopparmynt = 1 Öre SM
1 Daler SM = 96 Öre SM (1643)
Sweden is where it all started, in 1643. A Swedish copper mine in Falun produced 2/3 of the worlds copper, and they decided to mint large coins to benefit with this, and control the price of copper.

The first denomination was a giant 10 Daler. Called the largest coin of classic numismatics, it weights 20 kilos! Later there were 1/2, 1, 2, 4 and 8 daler plates, too. 1/2, 1, 2 and 4 daler plates aren't so uncommon, but nowadays the 8 daler and 10 daler plates are very uncommon and cost a lot more than the others.

Today, about 11000-12000 plate money coins exist (~3000 from the Nicobar shipwreck). Only a few of these are 10 and 8 taler plates. Other denominations that are said to exist are 1/3, 3 and 5 daler plates. I have found no proof of their existance, so either they are extremely rare, dont exist anymore or have never existed.


Pictures:

I did not find the nice picture of a 1 daler plate compared to a 2€ coin, but here is sc.rednek's photo from july that "inspired" me. Weirdly I always thought that plate money costs thousands.

Thats a 2 daler. The 10 daler (X daler) coin compared to a 2 daler, only twice smaller:

It truly is a giant coin.




Russia

The Russian empire also had their own plates. These are much rarer. In Russia, plate money was minted 1725-26. .

Denominations of 1, 5, 10 (Grivna), 25 (Polupoltina), 50 (Poltina) kopecks and 1 Rouble were minted.

They weren't as large.
Here is a picture of a dime and a Russian plate:



Wismar

Plate money was minted during the siege of Wismar. These siege plate coins are extremely rare, and only a few exist anymore.

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces146700.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces147433.html
They were minted mostly from melted cannons and probably also cannon balls.


Plate money has also been popular in the world of numismatics. For a long time.

It's definitely one of my favorite "coins"!

As time went on the plates became smaller for the same value, it had inflation just like every other currency. By their end in 1750's, it was about 750 grams per Daler, compared to 2000 grams per Daler in 1643.

Fun fact is that their massive weight and inconvenience led to the establishment of the first central bank and the first banknotes.

Non-shipwreck examples, even a late date 1/2 Daler will probably be over a thousand dollars. All the known 10 Dalers are in museums so you're out of luck there, and the 8's are incredibly rare and stupid expensive.

But Nicobar recoveries (and there's also a few hundred known from other shipwrecks) are indeed much cheaper, about 1/10th the price. I was very happy to find my 1750 2 Daler with a readable denomination stamp and 2 of the 4 date stamps, a LOT of shipwreck ones don't have anything readable. And personally, I think the added history is interesting.

Monninen1 just posted this in the "Additions to your collection" thread, I hope he doesn't mind me sharing it here as well. 4 Daler from 1735!

And I'm an idiot, you were the original poster of this thread and I just now noticed that...

I'm assuming Nicobar as well?

It is from the Nicobar. 4 daler plates usually cost a lot, but the seawater corrosion is heavy. I would have not bought it if the corner stamp and the middle stamp could not be seen.

The same seller had more plate money, including a 1/2 daler not from the nicobar. It was sold for 600€.

Many differend kinds of plate money exist, for example the corner stamps are different in this 1675 2 daler. Quite a bad example as this is not a usual coin, this is a 2 daler plate minted in Pajala, Finland, 1675, found in 1903 with 9 other plate money. 4 of those were unique back then and this is the only one that is still unique. Notice "Air" under Sölff.Myt. It means Abraham and Jakob Reenstierna, the owners of this "mint".

Here in Finland, after the demonetization of the plate money, they said that the plate money could be kept and used or shipped to another country. They could also be changed, 12 1 daler plates for 1 riksdaler.

Quote: "sc.rednek"​It's definitely one of my favorite "coins"!
​
​As time went on the plates became smaller for the same value, it had inflation just like every other currency. By their end in 1750's, it was about 750 grams per Daler, compared to 2000 grams per Daler in 1643.
​
​Fun fact is that their massive weight and inconvenience led to the establishment of the first central bank and the first banknotes.
​
​Non-shipwreck examples, even a late date 1/2 Daler will probably be over a thousand dollars. All the known 10 Dalers are in museums so you're out of luck there, and the 8's are incredibly rare and stupid expensive.
​
​But Nicobar recoveries (and there's also a few hundred known from other shipwrecks) are indeed much cheaper, about 1/10th the price. I was very happy to find my 1750 2 Daler with a readable denomination stamp and 2 of the 4 date stamps, a LOT of shipwreck ones don't have anything readable. And personally, I think the added history is interesting.

​During a relatively small time, there was a lot of different banknotes and coins in use. When the plate money was first used, the first riksdaler was still in use. The first banknotes were issued in 1662, when the first riksdaler was in use. Soon after the second riksdaler replaced the first, for 50 years.

100 riksdaler SM 1666
Then, for 4 years they used underweight 1 daler coins, only 3.6 grams. 1715:

Then came the fourth riksdaler. During this time the plate money was demonetized. (After the fourth, came the fifth. Then came riksdaler banco and riksdaler riksmynt, and finally the krona. )

@Monninen
Out of curiosity, are there any other examples of "plate money" other than the ones listed here?

I mean surely there must be some instances from other places, right?

Japanese Obans and Kobans are essentially gold plates, naturally far smaller because of the material.

Quote: "CassTaylor"​@Monninen
​Out of curiosity, are there any other examples of "plate money" other than the ones listed here?
​
​I mean surely there must be some instances from other places, right?

​I searched a lot, but I did not find any. Some countries have used countermarked silver ingots as money.
For example the Quan ingot money: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces16251.html (many other pieces exist, also for example brazil and ceylon had ingot money)

Of course there are the klippes, but most klippes dont weight over 50g. The largest klippe on numista is ~80g


The closest coin to these plate money (Weight + date + Shaped somehow like a plate) is the Japanese 10 Ryo. https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces16673.html

I do not know of any other copper plate money

Quote: "Monninen1"​

Quote: "CassTaylor"​@Monninen
​​Out of curiosity, are there any other examples of "plate money" other than the ones listed here?
​​
​​I mean surely there must be some instances from other places, right?

​​I searched a lot, but I did not find any. Some countries have used countermarked silver ingots as money.
​For example the Quan ingot money: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces16251.html (many other pieces exist, also for example brazil and ceylon had ingot money)
​
​Of course there are the klippes, but most klippes dont weight over 50g. The largest klippe on numista is ~80g
​
​
​The closest coin to these plate money (Weight + date + Shaped somehow like a plate) is the Japanese 10 Ryo. https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces16673.html
​
​I do not know of any other copper plate money

​I found this weird topic:
https://en.numista.com/forum/topic52250.html

Ingots, that reminds me; last month I added these three Dutch East India Company bars (listed in Krause) to Ceylon:
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/index.php?mode=simplifie&p=1&l=ceylan&r=bar&e=ceylan&d=&ca=3&no=&i=&v=&m=&a=&t=&dg=&w=&u=&f=&g=&c=&tb=y&tc=y&tn=y&tp=y&tt=y&te=y&cat=y

I think I need these books
and, here is a Japanese plate:

Also, if anyone wants to buy a plate money:

2 Dalers on ebay:
https://m.ebay.com/itm/RARE-2-Daler-Copper-Plate-Money-Sweden-175-Good-Condition-675g-Nicobar-C/142922776681?hash=item2146dc8069:g:dhsAAOSwp6lbgOgJ
https://m.ebay.com/itm/RARE-2-Daler-Copper-Plate-Money-Sweden-1750-Very-Good-Condition-675g-Nicobar-B/132764371950?hash=item1ee95f8bee:g:ytkAAOSwp7RbgObA
And a older one: https://m.ebay.com/itm/Sweden-2-Daler-Plate-Money-Cannon-Bronze-Cast-404L/332784088667?hash=item4d7b7a365b:g:hbwAAOSwPSZbhrqR
Also a 4 daler on ebay:
https://m.ebay.com/itm/SWEDISH-COPPER-PLATE-MONEY-4-DALER-1736-EXCELLENT-EXAMPLE/192638440103?hash=item2cda2552a7:g:Q3sAAOSwbVdbgyZI

CoinArchives: https://www.coinarchives.com/w/results.php?search=daler+plate&s=0&upcoming=0&results=100
Sixbid: https://www.sixbid.com/search.html?search=daler

Im not very good at drawing did this to show how big these coins are:
(Notice im not so good drawing circles either)

From left to right: Fourth riksdaler copper coins (1Ö, 2Ö and 6Ö) 4 Daler SM plate, 8 Daler SM plate, Swedish silver coins from 1Ö to 2 Riksdaler, 2 Daler SM plate, 1 Daler SM plate, 10 (X) Daler SM plate and 1/2 Daler SM plate.

Note that the size of these coins isn't always the same

Comparing coins from top (comparing coins in a box next to the 10 daler) Morgan dollar, Australia 50P, 1€ and my smallest coin, Ottoman Akce.

(The stamps on these coins arent as big as they are on the real plate money, everything is really 5 times larger and the size of some coins may be wrong)

Quote: "sc.rednek"​Monninen1 just posted this in the "Additions to your collection" thread, I hope he doesn't mind me sharing it here as well. 4 Daler from 1735!
​
​

​The seller did not know what country "FI" stands for, so it took a lot time. He asked me, now the coin has just been posted. It'll take a long time for it to arrive, but I think it'll arrive right on time somewhere about a few days before 12.10, I hope, as 13.10 my two day mini-work-holiday starts.

I have an opportunity to buy a 10 daler copper plate that weighs 44 lb. I have no idea what this thing is worth. Can anyone provide insight? Thanks.

Quote: "lyricfive"​I have an opportunity to buy a 10 daler copper plate that weighs 44 lb. I have no idea what this thing is worth. Can anyone provide insight? Thanks.

​There's only a couple, and they're all in museums. I think you're being scammed.

Quote: "Monninen1"​
​Many differend kinds of plate money exist, for example the corner stamps are different in this 1675 2 daler. Quite a bad example as this is not a usual coin, this is a 2 daler plate minted in Pajala, Finland, 1675, found in 1903 with 9 other plate money. 4 of those were unique back then and this is the only one that is still unique. Notice "Air" under Sölff.Myt. It means Abraham and Jakob Reenstierna, the owners of this "mint".
​
​Here in Finland, after the demonetization of the plate money, they said that the plate money could be kept and used or shipped to another country. They could also be changed, 12 1 daler plates for 1 riksdaler.

​hello,
In the Baltic Sea, in the Kaliningrad region, three such plate money were found that week. So now there are no longer 9 known ones :)