First trade

I'm new to this site--was attracted by the fact that people are willing to trade coins--and I think I've figured out how to make these transactions. My point is: Does everyone on this site expect some kind of lengthy negotiation or are there a lot of people who are trying to 'get over" on you? I'm pretty fair and expected to be treated that way also. My first trade offer was so ridiculous that I immediately turned it down. I wanted about $16 worth of coins and he expected me to give him $100 worth of silver  coins in exchange. I messaged him and he said I need to learn to negotiate if I want to be on this site. All I can say is that I wasn't born yesterday and I'm a little disappointed in the trade offers so far. All I've asked for is equivalent value in exchange. I have managed to make 1 trade-it seemed equitable to me-and have a couple more in the works. I'll wait and see. Maybe I'll just keep selling on ebay.

There are always those who try to get one over on you.  Just ignore them and turn the request down flat.  It's best to try and swap with someone who has had a bit of experience and good feedback.  But don't get offended if they ask you to send the coins first, it's genuinely the way things work until you build up a good reputation.

I only had my first swap here less than a month ago myself. I second everything neilithic just said.
If in doubt, ask from mods or some old members for info or advice, they are nice and helpful.

There are scammers of course like everywhere in internet, use common sense or your sixth sense... if something seems too good to be true, it usually is. If the trade doesn't seem fair to you, you should never agree to it. Yea, negotiation is great, but negotiation is two-sided. No-one can dictate you what you "must" send them or stuff like that. And also be wary of scammer accounts who cross-rate each other or seem odd to you even if you can't put your finger on what's wrong. Better to be wary than regret I'd say.

Happy swapping

You will find that most people have removed any silver coins from their swap lists because of the hustlers trying to trade pocket change for them. Those with a wants list full of 19th century and silver coins but their own lists are full of modern ex-circulation coins worth less than face value.

I used to politely explain why the offer was silly. Some would move on, others would argue  so I decided it was too much trouble and pulled them all. More recently I've decided to simply ignore them and I'm slowly re-entering my duplicate silver.

Similarly I don't make trades with the more exotic parts of the world because of postal services which are little more than organized crime, unrealistic shipping costs from the US and the number of fake accounts set up purely for stealing. This apparently makes me a racist but at least I'm a racist who still has his coins.

Hell hath no fury like a scorned woman or swap partner. If I was to tell you that several members of this site have been named on a Jihadist website with a call to shut down the website and "hunt them down and break their bones" would you be concerned? You ought to be, the person responsible is still here. Any semblance of responsibility for the safety of members has been abandoned and it is for this reason I'm not making any trades with people I don't know.

Ask yourself, is it worth putting your safety and that of those around you at risk for the sake of a few coins? Getting the s***ty end of the stick in a trade is the least of your worries.

Be very careful who you choose to share your name, address and contact info with.

Yes phil is right. I had to remove all my silver from my swap list. And I still have very little on it. One time a silver coin got though, and someone tried to set up a swap for it. One coin and overseas. And to top it off my swap list was closed, I did not want to swap. Just start out slow and think. I do swap silver but with people I know or have swap with before. It's not too much of a problem for me. I collect mostly modern coins.  

I am currently busy with my 8th swap. All 7 completed swaps were great and some even threw in bonus coins! I now also include bonus coins. The coins I received in the swaps have always been as expected or better. All of the people I have swapped with have been open to negotiating.
If someone requests a swap, look at their feedback and then go with your gut feeling.

Happy swapping!

The other piece of advice I can give is to spend some time on the forums.  Most of the scammers aren't interested in chatting on the forums because they're just on the site to try and wheedle out some coins.  That's how I got into my first couple of swaps, I swapped with people I had become friendly with through chatting on the forums.

Yes, Neil. Good post young feller.

It's one of those so obvious points that it's not until someone brings it up that you think "Oh, yeah!"

Quote: neilithicThe other piece of advice I can give is to spend some time on the forums.  Most of the scammers aren't interested in chatting on the forums because they're just on the site to try and wheedle out some coins.  That's how I got into my first couple of swaps, I swapped with people I had become friendly with through chatting on the forums.

Yea that's great advice most of the time...though we have had a couple big exceptions...just don't get too friendly with any child from Canada looking for pricing advice on rare coins.

Quote: crruisercharlieI wanted about $16 worth of coins and he expected me to give him $100 worth of silver  coins in exchange. I messaged him and he said I need to learn to negotiate if I want to be on this site. All I can say is that I wasn't born yesterday and I'm a little disappointed in the trade offers so far.

Looks like you're cruisin' for a bruisin'. I wish we could just out these guys with their deals. Some of them are just looking to rape you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jR7y7g8h1y4

I'm sure there are a few of those types here. I'm curious as to who targeted you. If you want, you can PM me with more details. I know for a fact that there are leeches on the site that specifically target any and all newbies. They are pretty despicable and the part about learning to negotiate, well, you have to learn how to negotiate with an immoral thief. That is a specialized course. The rest of the folks here already know how to negotiate and deals with them can be quick, fair and painless.

Quote: pnightingaleAny semblance of responsibility for the safety of members has been abandoned and it is for this reason I'm not making any trades with people I don't know.

 Its too bad that there are a lot of scammers and I have seen a lot of folks get scammed. You need to be careful.

  I think if you had to pay one US dollar or one Euro in order to be allowed to swap, it would cut out a lot of that crap. I would be the first to pay my dollar!

Quote: SpookieAll 7 completed swaps were great and some even threw in bonus coins! I now also include bonus coins.

Happy swapping!

I love to see this, this is the true spirit of Numista! In my first swap the guy should not have even trusted me, I was such a novice, he asked for some of my coppers and I asked for silver. He sent his coins and there was a valuable free silver coin included! I have never been able to include such a gift like that in my swaps but I always send something small. Bonus coins are nice!

I agree entirely with our coppersmith magician. (check out his website, you'll see what I mean)

I have several small piles of coins which I'm saving for people who I know collect them. It costs very little but shows that you care. They are of no value to me but if it brightens somebody's day a little then that's priceless.

There are several members who routinely add some uncirculated coins from their home country to a swap. That's a really nice touch and one I'd like to see become more widespread. It shouldn't add much to the mailing cost and for a few cents you can give someone coins they would not otherwise have access to.

I often try to include 1-3 bonus coins. My last swap was with somebody I've swapped with 3 times before. I really wanted to include a few bonus coins (local UNC) but when I weighted all coins with packaging material I was going to use I got roughly to 500g. I had to be quite elaborate packing all this up because when a package is under 500g it costs me $18.20, but for a package that weights 501g I'd have to pay $35.69   I ended up with 493g package. I guess I could add one more coin after all. Will save it for our swap #5.  

Back on the topic though. I can definitely say that having honest conversation is always the key to a good and fair swap. I had to cancel quite a few because I didn't feel enough honestly on the other end.

crruisercharlie you only have 2 silver coins in your swap list, maybe you don't know to evaluate your coins or you under evaluated his coins.

It couldn't possibly be that in the intervening 25 days he has swapped some of his coins, or maybe experience has taught him that it's easier to simply remove silver coins from his list like most other members.

Noooooo.... it has to be the most demeaning explanation doesn't it?

On Dec 16th I sent my first two swaps out. Cheap swaps considering I have no rep but still I was happy 2 users (with good rep) approached me for a swap.

I try to stick to Krause rates, because that way it will be fair for both parties. And fortunately both users also used those rates for the swap, with a bit of 5-10% to their favor, but I agreed because of my 0 Rep and mainly because the swap cost was small.

One of the packs I sent was through Registered mail, and I'm worried because it hasn't appeared yet on the system to be tracked. I live in a small town and when I receive stuff through registered mail inside the country the last registry comes from Guadalajara, and it is 3 or 4 days before I get it. So I was thinking my pack would finally appear on the system by the 20th but it didn't and it hasn't. Maybe sending during holidays was a bad idea for a first swap. I just hope the mail doesn't screw me up, because with 0 Rep the blame would surely fall on me making future swaps no longer a possibility.

Well, on a different forum we have done a Secret Santa exchange, and there is a huge holiday lag within Canada alone.

My letter sent from the capital city of a province to a town in the same province almost 2 weeks ago has not yet arrived! The story is the same for many other domestic letters sent in this exchange: a member posts the coins they got, and the person who sent them usually returns with "Thank god, I had almost given up hope!". I think, after Christmas has passed, the postal service kicks back and takes a bit of a break. Can't blame them

I finally received a letter from Ukraine recently, 2 months after it was sent: I had a bit of an existential crisis and was wondering how long I should wait before asking about it, but when it finally came I realized that it is good to be patient for international post

Quote: nalaberongWell, on a different forum we have done a Secret Santa exchange, and there is a huge holiday lag within Canada alone.

My letter sent from the capital city of a province to a town in the same province almost 2 weeks ago has not yet arrived! The story is the same for many other domestic letters sent in this exchange: a member posts the coins they got, and the person who sent them usually returns with "Thank god, I had almost given up hope!". I think, after Christmas has passed, the postal service kicks back and takes a bit of a break. Can't blame them

I finally received a letter from Ukraine recently, 2 months after it was sent: I had a bit of an existential crisis and was wondering how long I should wait before asking about it, but when it finally came I realized that it is good to be patient for international post

I was talking about the coins I sent you  

Although our swap was through normal mail so I'm just hopping that by 2014 someday in January a post officer delivers it to your home and we will both be happy and relieved. The registered one is in-route to Spain, and it is the one that worries me because it hasn't appeared in the system yet, but holidays always make thing slower, so I just hope that by January the tracking appears or even better the pack suddenly arrives to its destination

I've taken down most of my silver coins because of problems like this.  I stopped swapping for several months because of this and am just getting back to the site.  It just got annoying.  I'd log on and I would have 10 new swap offers a day, people wanting silver coins and they would have nothing but modern stuff that wasn't worth anything.  I could have selected their whole swap list and it wouldn't have been worth the coins they were wanting.

Quote: jadejackalI've taken down most of my silver coins because of problems like this.  I stopped swapping for several months because of this and am just getting back to the site.  It just got annoying.

Is it just me that gets asked to desist in bashing Numista and told his comments are damaging on the forum, or does everyone who writes the truth get such messages?

Two of my last three Numista swaps went under the radar. That means we sent and received our coins without confirming anything or rating anything. Just have to read people, communicate with them, interact with them on the forum and the rest, including trust, falls into place on its own. It doesn't help to rely on any Numista security features because none exist. It also doesn't help that the forum is silent or dead, with the exception of topics like these, that often disappear or end up locked to cover up the true nature of Numista. Use your best judgement at your own risk.

https://en.numista.com/forum/topic5357.html
https://en.numista.com/forum/topic24844.html
https://en.numista.com/forum/topic25472.html
https://en.numista.com/forum/topic24130.html

I could easily get banned for writing this. I am on Numista mainly for the forum, it continues to disappoint, with over 32 000+ members.

Quote: jadejackalI've taken down most of my silver coins because of problems like this.  I stopped swapping for several months because of this and am just getting back to the site.  It just got annoying.  I'd log on and I would have 10 new swap offers a day, people wanting silver coins and they would have nothing but modern stuff that wasn't worth anything.  I could have selected their whole swap list and it wouldn't have been worth the coins they were wanting.

I did that too after the first few weeks.

After a while it occurred to me that I'm cutting off my nose to spite my face. I've ended up with lots of duplicate silver which kinda defeats the purpose of being a member of a website for swapping coins.

So I'm adding them back as time permits and I've adopted a new strategy for dealing with the hustlers and opportunists - I'm going to simply ignore them. I have neither the time or the inclination to type out several polite explanations every day as to why I don't wish to exchange valuable coins for worthless pocket change.

For the genuinely ignorant I might make an exception and briefly explain the facts of life but I'm fairly sure that 90% of these bastards are cynically trying to score cheap silver to resell on eBay.

Anyone wanting to waste an hour scouring my swap list and checking off every silver coin is welcome to do so. Don't hold your breath waiting for a response.

yeah, i think this is the right attitude to take in these cases. No point wasting time with people like that.

I don't have that problem- yet, as i don't have any duplicate silver coins. It does happen that people tick off a silver coin without even checking that it is silver, simply only checking that they don't have that coin.. but that mistake is easy to spot and to know the person is still a genuine swaper.

Or a simple "sorry, i only swap silver for silver" would do in case if its not sure if the other one is scammer or just silly.

"Turn down the swap offer" button is very useful though:)

You are a very wise Colleen.

I really don't mind swapping silver coins for zinc, lead, copper bronze or gold. I'm a coin collector not a wannabee bullion investor. But the coins being offered must have SOME value! I'm not in the business of swapping a $10 coin for 100 10c coins with zero numismatic interest.

I won't be swapping low grade silver at spot price while it's trading under $20, I'll wait until it rises to $50 and then unload it. Momma didn't raise no fools. But a coin with enough numismatic value to exceed spot price by as large margin, if y'all want to swap high grade 19th century copper for it based on K&M values there won't be a problem.

I've had people arguing the point in the past after declining a proposed swap with a polite explanation. Some of them even demand to swap one for one.

It's not the hustling which pisses me off, it's the implied assumption that I'm some kind of idiot.

As a new user that is exactly the point why I won't trade none of my silver. At least for a while. First I have to see how reliable my Mail service is, I already closed 3 swaps (and the 4th is almost done) and I'm waiting  for them to arrive, or see if the mail service just steals what I send out, in which case I'd have to resign swapping ever again. But on the other hand if they eventually reach destination as well as the ones that were sent to me, then that might be encouraging to keep up with the "pocket-change" swaps. And maybe some day, trade some of my extra precious silver with some of the most trusted users if they ever approach me that is.

Quote: erdvillaAs a new user that is exactly the point why I won't trade none of my silver. At least for a while. First I have to see how reliable my Mail service is, I already closed 3 swaps (and the 4th is almost done) and I'm waiting  for them to arrive, or see if the mail service just steals what I send out, in which case I'd have to resign swapping ever again. But on the other hand if they eventually reach destination as well as the ones that were sent to me, then that might be encouraging to keep up with the "pocket-change" swaps. And maybe some day, trade some of my extra precious silver with some of the most trusted users if they ever approach me that is.

Finally got the courage and traded with some users, 5 so far. Two of the swaps are now fulfilled and successful, so I am very happy for that. The other three are travelling to Russia and Ukraine so it'll be a matter of waiting for them to arrive. I just hope the political unrest in Ukraine doesn't make that package to get lost when it arrives to that country.

Quote: erdvillaFirst I have to see how reliable my Mail service is,

 If you swap long enough, a package will go missing, sadly one of the costs of our hobby. It might get you down but don't let it keep you out.

That s why i like to send first, to me it more inportant that the other person gets there coins.I dont know how i would fill if there coins came and mine when missing.I like to think karma will take care of it. I have lost some, but hope were ever they ended up some were someone is happy.

I havent lost any yet neither from the ones i sent or received. I hope it will never happen, but possibility is there. If packaged right, it should be ok in most cases. At least across Europe postal service in fast and reliable. Haven't done any swaps outside Europe yet.
A few packs from France got to me within 2 days. Unbelievable!!!

I truly appreciate this chat on the forum! Great advice! I've had good deals with swappers. Yes. I had to also retrieve my precious silver coins! But hey, the spirit of Numista is good! Even if we've lost in a bad swap ... Don't give up! There are heaps of good people around! Happy swapping!

Quote: ALLRED1950That s why i like to send first, to me it more inportant that the other person gets there coins.I dont know how i would fill if there coins came and mine when missing.I like to think karma will take care of it. I have lost some, but hope were ever they ended up some were someone is happy.

I couldn't answer you on the PMs because it says I cannot write to more than 10 users a day (I'm pretty sure they where only 8). So I hope you read this. Thanks for showing me the Indian coin, can you give me the Numista sheet URL?.

Dear erdvillia  Iam not sure how to do that,Iam B.C. But its km# is 92.2 under india. Sorry i can not be much help on that.

Allred, its not hard, you just go  to that coins page and copy and paste the part in your browser, it looks like this, https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces1627.html

  Just highlight whatever is in your browser, and copy and paste it, you could even type it out if you wanted.

  Thats how everyone shares these pages, here is what I need, https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces15061.html

The two packs I sent to Russia reached that country super fast. One has already been delivered because it was right in Moscow, so as soon as Customs released it it was delivered fast, the other one should arrive soon as well because it was headed to another big city (St. Petersburg). It was way faster than I expected. On the other hand the packs they sent in return should still take at least 10 days to reach me, because they haven't reached Mexico City yet. But that was really surprising. I was told 40-60 days, and the Moscow one got delivered in less than 20.

I'm so glad to have found this thread... realized I was doing allll sorts of things that look really bad to people who have been here awhile    . See, I was thinking of my "want list" as more of a "dream list"... as in, these coins are bloody awesome, but I probably won't be able to actually get them for a very long time because, darn, they are really old and amazing coins. But I've tried to add plenty of common, modern coins to my list now, and I re-wrote my "what I want" so people don't think I'm out to try and trade new less-valuable pieces for really valuable old ones.

Honestly, the truth is that I'm happy to swap for almost anything at this point, especially if it's not from Canada. I know I'm very new at this and I know a lot of my coins are either worse than very-good quality (which I always put in the comments) or not exactly super valuable. I was just an amateur collector until this point, and I didn't care about the worth of the coins at all... but if I want a lot of the coins I'm newly discovering that I want, I'm going to have to invest some money in this; otherwise I'll never improve my collection or get anything older or more valuable. I will almost certainly be doing a bunch of buying, either here or from eBay, wherever works (maybe both will!).

All rambling aside, though, thanks for this post and all the replies to it. It's super helpful for a n00b like me.  

Great thread.  Good info for neophytes.  I'm enjoying the forum reads immensely!   

A noob question. Where do u see a "wish list". I still haven't seen one anywhere? Or do you mean me marking down "I want that coin" which makes heart sign appear next to it?
Cos I have marked down many like that, but I thought no-one else sees it, I just done it to help with my search through other people's swap list as what I want is then easier to spot.

That's your wish list. The swap partners will appear in the order of coins that you'll want if you click on "coins that interest" you.
You can also write on your profile what you want or are interested in.