Warning on swaps with users with bad feedback

Hi,

I think the warning that appears on swap pages to alert a user that the swapper has bad feedback is poorly translated, and sounds very suggestive. It sounds like Numista is taking a side ("HE MIGHT BE A SWINDLER"), and not acting impartially as intended. Don't get me wrong, I like having the warning, but the wording isn't good.

It reads:

ATTENTION:
THIS MEMBER RECEIVED VERY NEGATIVE RATINGS FROM OTHER MEMBERS.
HE MIGHT BE A SWINDLER.
YOUS SHOULD BE VERY CAREFUL IF YOU WANT TO SWAP COINS WITH HIM.

I suggest something along the lines of:

WARNING:
This members feedback rating is low!
Please take this into consideration when engaging in a swap with this member.

Further more:
* I don't see it necessary to be in capitals, as it is in a red box. NO NEED TO SHOUT.
* Perhaps it should link to the policy in relation to the threshold at which the notice appears, so users know what this means.
* It should not appear for someone who has 2 votes consisting of 1 x 5 star vote and 1 x 0 star vote. This seem's unfair...

I do welcome the idea of warning on the users with bad feedback, but it can be made to feel a bit more friendly.

+1 in addition to "thumbs up"

I also agree.

Quote: SkeletorianHi,

I think the warning that appears on swap pages to alert a user that the swapper has bad feedback is poorly translated, and sounds very suggestive. It sounds like Numista is taking a side ("HE MIGHT BE A SWINDLER"), and not acting impartially as intended. Don't get me wrong, I like having the warning, but the wording isn't good.

It reads:

ATTENTION:
THIS MEMBER RECEIVED VERY NEGATIVE RATINGS FROM OTHER MEMBERS.
HE MIGHT BE A SWINDLER.
YOUS SHOULD BE VERY CAREFUL IF YOU WANT TO SWAP COINS WITH HIM.

I suggest something along the lines of:

WARNING:
This members feedback rating is low!
Please take this into consideration when engaging in a swap with this member.

Further more:
* I don't see it necessary to be in capitals, as it is in a red box. NO NEED TO SHOUT.
* Perhaps it should link to the policy in relation to the threshold at which the notice appears, so users know what this means.
*It should not appear for someone who has 2 votes consisting of 1 x 5 star vote and 1 x 0 star vote. This seem's unfair...

I do welcome the idea of warning on the users with bad feedback, but it can be made to feel a bit more friendly.

We have all been on tenter hooks lately. I do think this is a good idea. However, I disagree with your final point which I have underlined. The reason for this is that if a swap was bad it was bad and there should be no blurring of boundaries there. Taking the Capitals off is a good idea. The threshold is automatically made. It works on the last 5 swaps, so that if three are bad the website generates a warning. I shall approach Xavier on this matter, thanks.

Quote: bam777However, I disagree with your final point which I have underlined. The reason for this is that if a swap was bad it was bad and there should be no blurring of boundaries there.

Agree, a bad swap is a bad swap, but the point I was making is the boundaries seem already blurred and not the same rules for everyone:

For a new member with 2 total reviews, one negative review will raise the alert.

For an established member, they get 3 bad swaps.

So, it is true that existing members get more chances to get it wrong, than new members? Is that the intended behaviour? I personally think (and this view may not be shared) that repeat bad performance should be punished, not single situations (heck, the post systems in various countries are probably the cause for most negative feedback in some shape or form).

The reason I brought that point up, is that I've seen some new members profiles tarnished with the message, and they've perhaps only had one bad swap. It's a shame, because when the message shows, it's unlikely members will swap with them, and they may be decent people, just working out how the system or community work.

That's just my two pence worth, perhaps something to think about, and not the main point of my initial post however, which was about the wording, and I'm happy that that view is shared.  

We'll get the wording changed. To continue on the point we have a disagreement on. It is best of 5! So the moment it goes sour, the warning will show.
We have a number of duplicate account holders and scammers here and we are working on getting rid.
Postal problems are certainly to blame for a number of negative swaps. This comes down to trust.
A member contacted me recently to say that he had opened a investigation after two swaps and a gift went missing. He trusted me and our communication kept everything friendly and positive. Commuication is vital.

Personally I think it's fine as it is - this is just more PC rubbish; it's in a red box and capitals to catch the eye. What if someone is colourblind - they may just think it's some rubbish notification...

I think the word swindler or con-artist should be used, because some members seem to be very naive when it comes to swapping, irrespective of the warning in the first place !

One way to sort this would be to upgrade accounts to a paid member for instance, or add a 3 strikes system to the trading; 3 bad feedbacks and you're out - to be considered by the team to see if you can re- enter. I think this is the best option. You shouldn't be allowed to swap unless you have made at least one forum post too.. this way we will be able to detect puppet accounts; easier simple jibberish posts will show this.

I think the main focus should be on new collectors and fake/double accounts. Coming weeks you will see dropping more and more bad feedbacks on
https://en.numista.com/echanges/profil.php?id=31635
In my opinion a real swindler. And what will happen with his second account?
https://en.numista.com/echanges/profil.php?id=31322
This is coming from the the same address. Can we warn already or do we wait until he cheated some collectors first?
Maybe the warning on
https://en.numista.com/echanges/membre.php?id=23060
Should be an other text, because he also has some good feedback of well-known swappers!

I agree that probably many bad feedbacks on swappers with also good feedback are caused by lost post.
I swap 90% by regular mail and prefer to send some coins for a second time to a trusted swapper, in case of loss, then paying the high registered costs. In some cases as a swapper only want to use registered mail (probable lower register costs in that country), I would like to choose for sending first and only if he receive he can send regsitered back.

Quote: Mark240590Personally I think it's fine as it is - this is just more PC rubbish ... the word swindler or con-artist should be used, because some members seem to be very naive when it comes to swapping, irrespective of the warning in the first place !

... add a 3 strikes system to the trading; 3 bad feedbacks and you're out - to be considered by the team to see if you can re- enter. ... You shouldn't be allowed to swap unless you have made at least one forum post too..

Hey, looks like you may have turned off your compulsory British polite button for a bit... I like it.

One other place I hang out has a manditory 50 forum post requirement and 3 months of participation before you can swap, buy or sell items in their swap/buy/sell sections. They have to be real posts and on topic. None of that emoticon, +1, cool, nice or any other short nonsense qualifies. If you try to rack up pointless posts quickly, you get blocked and warned. Then you get another supervised chance to come back and play by the rules.

I'd be in favour of a few rules that make sense. After all, you get to join for free, you get free entertainment, opinions and advice, you can store a list of your coins for free, you can search the catalogue for free, you can see tons of photos for free and swap quite easily for free. Shouldn't that much great free stuff require a small level of commitment from a new member?

Numista has a lot to offer and should be usinig that as its bargaining power at "Hello, Welcome to Numista!". It would be a lot easier to weed out the bad apples at the early commitment stage.

Good point. I have been in talks with Xavier today and we are looking to sort that sort of thing out. I'm writing up some wording for a possible new forum section...so watch this space!

Quote: torontokubaOne other place I hang out has a manditory 50 forum post requirement and 3 months of participation before you can swap, buy or sell items in their swap/buy/sell sections. They have to be real posts and on topic. None of that emoticon, +1, cool, nice or any other short nonsense qualifies. If you try to rack up pointless posts quickly, you get blocked and warned. Then you get another supervised chance to come back and play by the rules.

I'd be in favour of a few rules that make sense. After all, you get to join for free, you get free entertainment, opinions and advice, you can store a list of your coins for free, you can search the catalogue for free, you can see tons of photos for free and swap quite easily for free. Shouldn't that much great free stuff require a small level of commitment from a new member?

Numista has a lot to offer and should be usinig that as its bargaining power at "Hello, Welcome to Numista!". It would be a lot easier to weed out the bad apples at the early commitment stage.

+1, cool, nice      

Quote: radrick007+1, cool, nice      

Don't start, I feel a rant coming on ...   ... my mistake, excuse me.

Oh oh, duck and cover!

Very good point by Kuba. Totally agree. 3 months and/or 50 posts may be a bit too harsh, but 1 month and 10 (15? 20?) meaningful (!) forum posts sound about right to me.

I merely piggybacked on the comments of others...

Quote: mic-w-nlI think the main focus should be on new collectors and fake/double accounts.

My only worry with the posting is that some people may not be as comfortable posting in English (or French) ... Just playing devils advocate here

Quote: cncote10My only worry with the posting is that some people may not be as comfortable posting in English (or French) ... Just playing devils advocate here

Absolutely, this website is known for catalogue lists and swaps before forums. Many do not speak or write French/English well enough to participate.

I do, however, think that a mandatory Numista 3 to 5 first swaps rule should force the newbie to post/mail first. Then he must wait for his letter to be received, prior to expecting one in return. This would eliminate newbie trust issues because it would be a Numista rule of membership.

There could also be a random request, that at any given time a Team Member may request a group photo of any random combination of the coins in your coin list (3 to 5 rare/valuable ones), for the first 3 months. This would establish proof that the newbie has the coins.

If you haven't been on Numista for more than 3 months, the only way you can advertise your for sale coins to members on the forum, would be with a link to a third party auction site. The auction must be active and yours (not through a friend of a friend you met once), if you wish to be a seller on Numista as soon as you arrive. Let eBay's policies protect Numista members from rookies.

Give me a bit more time and I can probably come up with a couple more ideas that make sense to me.

My recommendation:
1) The new collectors have earned their trust with good swaps.
2) if the collector is not made ​​at least 10 to 15 positive swap, then do not send coins as long as you have not received a tracking number (which you have checked) or coins.