Adding Bethune under Feudal France? [solved]

5 posts • viewed 45 times

This message aims at: requesting the creation or the modification of an issuer in the catalogue

Status: Done
Upvotes: 2
Downvotes: 0

I wonder where to put this coin.

 

It is listed under Bethune by the auction, which is currently missing in Numista (besides some Notgeld coinage).

Friedberg lists it under Bethune as well, and the listed Delmonte number suggests it's under feudal France there too.

 

There currently are 2 coins on Numista from that Jean III, which are under Namur (Belgian States). I don't know anything about that region/time-period, but these sources seem to suggest we should have a new issuer. I would be interested in what you think and what the difference between the issuers is under Jean III.

I'm invoking Tdziemia here! :-)

I guess it is this coin:  https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=2432356

 

The two coins you linked in the catalog are coins of the County of Namur, so I think they are in the right place.  John III was Count of Namur, and these coins were struck there. 

 

So that leaves us the dilemma of this coin, that bears titles of the Count of Namur and Lord of Bethune together.  I can't find John III listed as Lord of Bethune, but this list dies out about 100 years before him:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_B%C3%A9thune#:~:text=Lords%20of%20B%C3%A9thune%20and%20Advocates%20of%20Arras,-In%201639%20Andr%C3%A9&text=Robert%20II%2C%20lord%20of%20B%C3%A9thune,founder%20of%20a%20separate%20branch.

 

We have other examples of confusion in titles in the Low COuntries at this time (Ligny & Sanit Pol), but I respect  Mr. Kondrat at WCN a lot, and if you say the Delmonte number looks like it's in France, then those are two positive votes,  so I say yes, we should set up Feudal France, Bethune, Lordship of, even if it only has this one coin (maybe we also move this one there, so it has company N#339435).  

(The lion at the end of the reverse legend on the florin is the symbol of Namur, and this is the normal place for a mint mark on florins, so it's likely that the coin was struck there).  .  

 

When I get a chance, I will see if I can find this coin in Chalon (Namur) or RBN.  

 

(You really have a knack for finding obscure stuff 😉).

I created the issuer and sent a request to move the existing Maille in it :-)

This type is also NOT listed in Renier Chalon's Recherches sur les monnaies de Comtes de Namur, which is still the most often cited reference for Namur. 

 

.. helping to confirm that Bethune is as good a choice as any.

Status changed to Done (Compendium, 18 Jun 2023, 01:39)

» Forum policy

Used time zone is UTC+2:00.
Current time is 07:12.