Belgian Congo: A kingdom in a democratic republic? [solved]

That's quite interesting as a constellation, and I don't think it's correct. Maybe somebody knows how to put it right?

I found out because when you search for Belgian Congo, you have to go for the Dem Rep of Congo.....

Yet another example of a completely absurd result due to the hiding of historical issuer names. How much longer are the admins responsible for this going to stick their heads in the sand?

We have too many would-be changers of history in numista...... and some times their wishes come through and then we have whatever rubbish somebody figured out by himself and it got approved without any control by some referee and now that has become a "fact" in Numista!

Both Belgian Congo & Congo Free State should be in separate subsections - as should Zaire.

Aidan.

Let's get back to the order of SCWC, where it was easy to find a country! Up to now, I haven't found that numista has improved anything with issuers and rulers......

I wouldn't say SCWC is perfect but it's a lot more accurate than Numista is at the moment.

Quote: "ceh2019"​I wouldn't say SCWC is perfect but it's a lot more accurate than Numista is at the moment.

​Nobody is, but too many chefs spoil the meal

I will just say that I do not envy the job of ANY catalog creator to deal with a few thousand years of world history and to keep every user happy.

Quote: "Sjoelund"​

Quote: "ceh2019"​I wouldn't say SCWC is perfect but it's a lot more accurate than Numista is at the moment.

​​Nobody is, but too many chefs spoil the meal

​
Too many cooks spoil the broth is the correct expression in English.

Schoen catalogue numbers should be used - including when a KM number hasn't been assigned.

Aidan.

Yeah, in my rear head I knew that, but in Danish we say
"for mange kokke fordærver maden" - too many chefs spoils the broth (English) - Viele Köche verderben den Brei (German)- Demasiados cocineros echan a perder el cocido (Spanish) - trop de cuisiniers gâtent la sauce (French).

Proverbs are always difficult. When you speak 5 languages it starts to become complicated to remember all of them.....

I think the topic should be simpler: seeing the table of the currency that Ole puts in his first post, it indicates that the issuer is: Democratic Republic of the Congo, but this country did not exist when that currency was issued (1910-1928) in this period Belgian Congo is the only issuer of this coin, so that leads to confusion and does not make our catalog more effective, neither historically nor numismatically speaking.

If it is only a question of whether the surface of the issuer has not changed when its status (not their form of government) has changed, why do we still keep together the German Empire, the Weimar Republic and the Third Reich if the surface of the three issuers is clearly different?

I give up, everybody wants to change the past and the history. It's getting to d...... complicated, so that is impossible to know, what to search for! Is that the end goal of numista, not knowing where to find the coins you want to find?

From previous communications with stratocaster (the admin behind all this nonsense) the driving force is an ill-concieved section of the guidelines which, despite all the protests, is apparently non-negotiable. Meanwhile things just get worse and worse.

Yes I agree the “new” method is a lot more complicated compared to simply just typing in what it says on the coin or Banknote!

Sorry about that I bet for the last several months it’s been hard to find coins from the correct search criteria in the catalogue because It’s incorrect here but everywhere else in other databases and references It’s correct.

Quote: "Worldwide collection"​Yes I agree the “new” method is a lot more complicated compared to simply just typing in what it says on the coin or Banknote!
​
​Sorry about that I bet for the last several months it’s been hard to find coins from the correct search criteria in the catalogue because It’s incorrect here but everywhere else in other databases and references It’s correct.

​What are you talking about? Your answer is straight out not making any sense

Quote: "Sjoelund"​

Quote: "Worldwide collection"​Yes I agree the “new” method is a lot more complicated compared to simply just typing in what it says on the coin or Banknote!
​​
​​Sorry about that I bet for the last several months it’s been hard to find coins from the correct search criteria in the catalogue because It’s incorrect here but everywhere else in other databases and references It’s correct.

​​What are you talking about? Your answer is straight out not making any sense

​The “new method” means that you have to research in Numista a coin that has one name on it and to be able to find it you have to find the successor states name.

Also as I said in the second paragraph in all other numismatic websites and databases is correct and here it’s not. For example a Ceylon coin in almost all other catalogues and references it would be listed under Ceylon but here it’s Sri Lanka.

SCWC has BOTH Ceylon and Sri Lanka, but not for the same coins!

Quote: "Sjoelund"​SCWC has BOTH Ceylon and Sri Lanka, but not for the same coins!

​Yes that’s what I meant.

Hello,

It was indeed decided some time ago to rationalize the definition of an issuer.

You will find find the definition in the guidelines.
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/contributions/instructions.php#issuers

Quote: "Catalogue Guidelines"An issuer is any:
- organised community (for example, Australia, Commune of Nice, Abbey of Saint Gall, Rauraci tribe),
- association of such communities (for example, Eurozone, West African States, joint notgeld issuers), or
- autonomous mint that regulates currency (for example, the Imperial mint of Basel)
with a claimed right to issue currency.

An issuer may have different currencies, governments and names throughout its history. For example, "Ceylon" and "Sri Lanka" are considered as a single issuer in the Numista catalogue.
Only when the territory of an issuer suffers a sudden, significant, and long-term change, resulting in a discontinuity of its currency, then the change result in a different issuer. For example the Soviet Union and modern-day Russia are listed as different issuers.

Congo Free State, Belgian Congo, Republic of the Congo (Léopoldville), Zaire, Congo free state, and Democratic Republic of the Congo are different names for the same territory, the same people, under different types of government. So they should be considered as the same issuing authority, but under different ruling authorities.
This topic has been discussed again and again in the past, and I don't want to change this part of the guidelines.

Still I understand it can be confusing in some cases, like Ole's screenshot above. Therefore I made two changes to give more visibility to former country names:

1. When the ruling authority belongs to a period with a different country name, that country name is now displayed on the issuer line


2. When typing a former country name in the dropdown list of issuers, the dropdown now shows not only the current name of the matching issuers but also the former name.

Quote: "Xavier"​It was indeed decided some time ago to rationalize the definition of an issuer.
​

​There's nothing rational about this decision. If you're going to partially restore the old names in some parts of the catalogue, why not restore them in the main catalogue pages as well? There are very good reasons why this issue keeps on coming up. The errors it has created aren't going to go away.