I will no longer reply to any swap proposals from people trying to swap worthless coins against good coins. Total swap value should at least be near balance. Or am I wrong, and should I just give away commemo euro coins and silver coins ?
I don't like to waste my time (and money) on these swaps !
Tony...the most important thing is that both parties are happy in a swap. Maybe think about putting something similar on your profile page and explain this to the proposer when declining the swap. A simple polite message can go quite far. It will happen...something for nothing.
Matt has mentioned putting notes on particular coins saying what he is looking for in return. This is a good idea. There is nothing wrong with your decision as long as there is communication between the proposed swapper.
I will no longer reply to any swap proposals from people trying to swap worthless coins against good coins. Total swap value should at least be near balance. Or am I wrong, and should I just give away commemo euro coins and silver coins ?
I don't like to waste my time (and money) on these swaps !
Greetings
Tony
couldn't agree more. I say specifically in my profile if you can help me upgrade my collection offer me a swap but all I ever get are people who want my hardest to get coins but who only have inexpensive, common date stuff to trade. I've stopped responding for that reason. Not worth my time.
I have a few duplicate silver coins which I'm hesitant to list for the reasons stated above.
Let me be clear, I don't have any objection to exchanging silver coins for base metal coins and vice versa - I'm a coin collector not a PM investor. I am just as happy acquiring Victorian copper coins as I am plugging a few gaps in my quarter and half dollar collections.
I'm at the early stages of building a collection of Swiss and Polish coins, most of which are of very low value so it makes perfect sense to me to trade my own lower value coins for these. Moving slightly up the food chain, I'm well underway with Third Reich issues, Rhodesian coinage and USSR Roubles. These (series where the country still exists but in a different form - see the pattern?) are a little more expensive so I expect to have to offer coins of similar value or a whole lot of "pocket change" types.
I would like to use Numista to improve my US/UK silver collection but I'm guessing that most people have removed their silver / pre 20th century coins long ago. I could list my duplicates but if all that is being offered is common date modern coins then what is the point?
I'm not a coin snob, I understand that for collectors on a budget, low value coins are the way to go and I am more than happy to trade assuming there are some interesting coins on offer. They don't have to be expensive, just something I need. There is also the cost of postage, if you only have a few low quality coins to trade it's unlikely that there will be enough value to justify the cost of mailing.
Having said all of the above, Numista is more than just a place to trade coins. I've met (digitally at least) some great people here. Some of them share the same collecting interests or are just so well versed that I can drop them a line any time I have a question. Some are just great guys who I enjoy trading with, chatting with and occassionally arguing with :)
I think I will try listing a few better quality coins over the next few days just to test the waters. My fear is that it will lead to a deluge of offers from people with pocket change to offer in return, my hope is that it will unearth a few more serious collectors with whom I can enjoy the benefits of trading collector to collector instead of via the coin dealers. Time will tell.
Non illegitimis carborundum est. Excellent advice for all coins.
Make Numismatics Great Again!
I understand this arguement and I don't blame y'all for it. But I'll be honest. After 5 years of collecting coins I still can tell a rare and valueable coin from a coin that is just uncommon and not of great value, unless I have had some dealing with it at some point and thus had reason to research it.
I don't look up each coin in each trade, to be honest. I just pick coins that I don't have and see what comes of it. I guess that makes me, one of those people that makes evryone so mad. Sorry.
We need a way to show the difference between common, uncommon, rare and ultra rare coins that we can use to compare when making an offer.
Until then, I don't see the worthless offers ending.
There is a topic on the forum now about adding a value to the coin pages. Maybe this would help.
Quote: ctuckerI understand this arguement and I don't blame y'all for it. But I'll be honest. After 5 years of collecting coins I still can tell a rare and valueable coin from a coin that is just uncommon and not of great value, unless I have had some dealing with it at some point and thus had reason to research it.
I don't look up each coin in each trade, to be honest. I just pick coins that I don't have and see what comes of it. I guess that makes me, one of those people that makes evryone so mad. Sorry.
We need a way to show the difference between common, uncommon, rare and ultra rare coins that we can use to compare when making an offer.
Until then, I don't see the worthless offers ending.
There is a topic on the forum now about adding a value to the coin pages. Maybe this would help.
I think the issue isn't so much about the numismatic value of a coin which is ultimately decided by collectors themselves. It's about people with one eye on the spot price trying to scoop up the silver coins in exchange for common date, modern base metal coins.
To be honest with you Tom, in the majority of trades I don't check the value of each coin either. I know the approximate cost of common coins in each series I actively collect and for key dates I do a little research before setting out to get one. Other than that I don't really care if I'm swapping a 50 cent coin for a $1 one, I'm looking to improve my collection not my bank balance. (you may have noticed, these two aims seem to be mutually exclusive). I reckon if you are one of "those people" then I'm in good company my friend!
At some point, the price of silver will tank ala Hunt Brothers, and the "investors" will move on to the next get rich quick scheme and leave us collectors alone. Until then I will remain patient and concentrate on building my collection of copper coins :)
Happy Thanksgiving to you and all our other US collectors.
Non illegitimis carborundum est. Excellent advice for all coins.
Make Numismatics Great Again!
I will no longer reply to any swap proposals from people trying to swap worthless coins against good coins. Total swap value should at least be near balance.
You and me both. I wondered at first if your post was a cynical dig at me, but then I realised I was just being paranoid. Mistakes do happen. I don't check the value of every coin I select fpr a swap, and even when you do you don't know the grade - in a recent turned down swap I was accussed of trying it on because one coin was supposedly worth a lot - and yet I had checked the VF grade book prices for ALL the coins concerned and they balanced, indeed they were a little in favour of the other party. I suspect the swap was declined was because I removed my Lundy Puffin and Olympic Commemoratives from the deal.
I never knowingly request silver in exchange for base metal coins, but did it once by accident, but now find myself apologising in advance in case I do request valuable coins in exchange for requested low value coins.
I no longer list anything decent for a swap, unless I am dealing with people I know and trust. But even then, the cost of the postage can become prohibitive. To send a coin out of the UK costs me about £2, but with tracking it costs an additional £6 and upwards, why should I want to spend perhaps almost £10 on postage? I can probably buy the coin on eBay for that!
I will no longer reply to any swap proposals from people trying to swap worthless coins against good coins. Total swap value should at least be near balance.
You and me both. I wondered at first if your post was a cynical dig at me, but then I realised I was just being paranoid. Mistakes do happen. I don't check the value of every coin I select fpr a swap, and even when you do you don't know the grade - in a recent turned down swap I was accussed of trying it on because one coin was supposedly worth a lot - and yet I had checked the VF grade book prices for ALL the coins concerned and they balanced, indeed they were a little in favour of the other party. I suspect the swap was declined was because I removed my Lundy Puffin and Olympic Commemoratives from the deal.
I never knowingly request silver in exchange for base metal coins, but did it once by accident, but now find myself apologising in advance in case I do request valuable coins in exchange for requested low value coins.
I no longer list anything decent for a swap, unless I am dealing with people I know and trust. But even then, the cost of the postage can become prohibitive. To send a coin out of the UK costs me about £2, but with tracking it costs an additional £6 and upwards, why should I want to spend perhaps almost £10 on postage? I can probably buy the coin on eBay for that!
Matt
this is the problem, not enough decent coins are being offered here to make it worth my time. I have to wade through a long list of coins and after awile these lists all look the same. All I see is the obvious, easy to obtain, modern stuff. I agree with pnightingale it's a good site otherwise, but I can't see swapping with someone half way around the world when I can just go to the local coin shop and buy these type coins cheaply - if I wanted them (which I don't). I hope people don't think I'm rude, I'm just not going to respond at all to any offers unless you have something decent to trade.
I think that the most important thing is that you happy with what you get.
Some people look for specific coins, and for them some coins can be much valued (of much less...)
I know I think that way while swaping, so as for real value, sometimes I loose, sometimes I earn. But ! when I see that the differences are too high - I do cancel the swap. every thing have it limits.
As I see it, it's all ends in how much a specific coin is valued for [b]you[/
I see that I am not the only one here experiencing some swapping problems, and I love all your reactions.
I never check coin values in a swap, and I mostly add some extra coins (for those that didn't get any in a swap : maybe the weight limit of the letter was already reached ), but when I'm asked to send several coins worth a few euros, and I'll get nothing interesting in return, that's where I draw the line.
Anyway, like everywhere there will be some people here that try to make a profit. We just have to pay some attention, no need yet to make a "good" and "bad" swappers list.
theres always an oppertunity to decline swaps or specific coins that arent worth while in each swap and each person makes that decision upon there own so really no one can be blamed but ourselves its probably happened to us all one time or another but its probably happened on both sides of the stick too! some swaps your like aww hell no was it really worth it then others your like shit geay that was great i guess your karma on how you deal with others while trading will eventually balance itself out in the end of coarse im not going to trade 5 morgan dollars for 5 canadian quarters but if i did that would be my own ******* fault but then again there are those nickel and dimers tryin to pinch their pennies or maybe some people just really have no idea about pricing
and just add whatever going fishing to see what they can catch but each his own
Another issue is one of scarcity. I live near the Channel Islands, and so we get quit a large number of Jersey and Guernsey coins here, which in other parts of the world are quite scarce. No more or less valuable, just scarce.
Similarly, take the US dollars ranges. Common as dirt in the USA, but I never see them in the UK. So I have been happily swapping UK 50p commemoratives for them with an American. The 50p commemoratives are naturally common here in the UK (well, some of them are!) but scarce in the USA.
So it is with swaps. I made a swap with a man who visits Madagascar, Madagascan coins are rare in the UK, but common in Madagscar, not valuable per se.
To this end, I look for coins to receive in a swap which are scarce in the UK and which as such I am unlikely to pick up locally.
then again some people may think they are getting a better deal then others when theyre really not me myself i just try to fill the holes and its hard to find folks with many coins to offer that i need half the time im taking 4 or 5 doubles just to get 4 or 5 coins i need so the swap would be at about 10 coins
Quote: Matt ProbertAnother issue is one of scarcity. I live near the Channel Islands, and so we get quit a large number of Jersey and Guernsey coins here, which in other parts of the world are quite scarce. No more or less valuable, just scarce.
Similarly, take the US dollars ranges. Common as dirt in the USA, but I never see them in the UK. So I have been happily swapping UK 50p commemoratives for them with an American. The 50p commemoratives are naturally common here in the UK (well, some of them are!) but scarce in the USA.
So it is with swaps. I made a swap with a man who visits Madagascar, Madagascan coins are rare in the UK, but common in Madagscar, not valuable per se.
To this end, I look for coins to receive in a swap which are scarce in the UK and which as such I am unlikely to pick up locally.
Matt
This is the basis where my swapping occurs. Demand is high for our commemoratives...we can supply...(if we have them). I need to hurry up and post my swap guide!
All of your points are very valuable in discussion. We have this hobby that draws us to beautifully designed (most of the time) coins and seek others to collect. There will be good and bad swaps. There will be the unfair feedback, the scammers, the kind, the generous, and the genuine. The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly. We just have to live with it, I guess. I posted a five pound coin and several silver 3 pences, my swapper "never received the coins"...I didn't receive the coin he was going to send me. As he wasn't going to send it until he received my coins. Did he skank me? Did it get lost in the post? I'll never know. BUT...I'll never trade with that kind of person again. Like Phil has said; this coin isn't just about the trading...it is about the things that we share in common, an interest we pursue together, we have added more coins to the catalogue, we are learning almost everyday about coins. Sometimes I repetetively check the forum for Matt's new thread, SmartOne pulling it out of the bag with a identification, Makake sorting out the data, the shrewd Xavier only putting in when he deems it necessary. It is quality, and sadly I find myself addicted... Anyway; I still wish you all well, I like the swap when it goes well.
I could start a new thread...but I reckon some people on here don't collect coins at all!
Quote: bam777I reckon some people on here don't collect coins at all!
I reckon your right. I think some people on here are scrap metal merchants, looking to bag "silver" and don't know a centime from a dirham - which is fine, we were all young once - but much less care, which is not so forgivable!
While I have you online, do you get many of the Women's Suffrage 50ps over in Kent? I have two, but haven't seen one in the wild for a long time. VCs I have coming out of my ears, and we even get Girl Guides, but no Kew Gardens.
see bam you have 9 coins i need on your list they all seem to be 50 pence coins i may have none that interest you would it be unfair for me to create an offer for your 9 fifty pences ? there may not be 9 of mine that would equal what you think is valued to those that you seek . so am i wrong for making such an offer ?no im not trying to scam you but maybe thats how it would appear to you if i only had a few common coins that interested you .
but how am i to know if swap monitor says there are 30 coins that may interest him/her ? maybe i would swap 20 coins for his 9 pence then swap wouldnt seem so lopsided >
this is just an example but i think thats alot of whats going on the key is in the communication with the person your dealing with maybe they will maybe they wont but how can anyone say theyre not in it for the money{hahahaha} i guess in the long run its all about the money
i mean theres book value and theres actual value and theres sentimental value
1.book value average price on what collectors pay for the coin
2.actual value if not demonitized compared to others currency value 4 circulated mexican pesos isnt really worth four u.s. dollars
3.sentimental value - i searched along time for this coin to get and just stumbled on two of them but think its really cool and would hate to see it go unless its for something i really want
i suppose all three could play a part while swapping with someone maybe everyone should just assign a swap value to each coin 1 through 10 ten 10 being the highest 1 the lowest then you could compare what each person feels the swap value of their own coin is and swap accordingly
Quote: 0gramzsee bam you have 9 coins i need on your list they all seem to be 50 pence coins i may have none that interest you would it be unfair for me to create an offer for your 9 fifty pences ?
You must know that 50p coins are current in the UK, and as such each has a value of 60 pence (actually some are worth a lot more, but we should let you off that).
So, if you are in the USA, then you will know that 50p is equivalent to 80c. Bearing that in mind, there is no harm in requesting a swap, if it turns out you have nothing that bam (or who ever) is interested in they may politely decline the swap by saying "thanks, but you have nothing I want at this time". There is no ill feeling in that.
BUT
If I were to approach you, and say oh I'd like that 2010P Dime you have (which we both know is intrinsically worthless) and you say, sure, I'd like that UK 2006 commemorative 50p in exchange then you KNOW you are extracting the urine, offering a coin with a value of 10c in exchange for one worth at least 80c.
This is a somewhat exagerated example, but I think you should be able to get the idea.
No one said swaps have to be one for one. Perhaps you have six or seven dimes, I want, each only worth their face value, but you offer me all six or seven for that same solitary 50p, then its a much fairer arrangement.
Or am I living in cloud-cuckoo land? It is Friday evening after all, and I really should be down the pub gazing at the bar maid's cleavage and swigging pints of Guiness <g>
yes thats exact point i was getting if someone puts up swap first theres no way to tell but if someone else engages swap then it should be countered with a not so insulting match
me myself wouldnt mind swaping ike dollars for 50 pence coins but all of what i said was for example not aimed for anyone in particular it just goes to show how certain situations could develop when sheisty experienced collectors try get one over on less experienced newbies ive added all 2 euro coins to swaps before becouse thats all some collectors seem to have that i dont with no intention of swapping for them all just for them to mark a few they were comfortable with swapping if any of my duplicates interested them but if someone even offered me an amazing offer i felt i was taking advantage of them i would let them know it wasnt quit equal just in case they had no idea or else throw them a bunch of bonuses ive done it before maybe like 5.00 worth extra just becouse i thought my side was unfairly but then again its hard to tell like you said who knows the condition of the coins ive seen alot of people add little comments on the side and thats a good sign of an experienced swapper or at least someone whos orderly and thats nice to know while swapping but theres so many things that come into effect whether or whether not to make a swap im sure we could go on and on as for me i just roll with the punches its better then playing the lottery you win some you lose some i guess its really a gamble sending envelopes to random people you hardly know or only have spoke with a few paragraphs thats why the honest swappers build a resume and the scammers get weeded out maybe we could build a list of bogues addresses known for that it could be another helpful tool in the fight against coin crimes
Quote: 0gramzmaybe we could build a list of bogues addresses known for that it could be another helpful tool in the fight against coin crimes
They are doing that on Colnect as we speak. I like the idea as it targets those low lifes who join with the single aim of scamming others and once the game is up they just create a new account. Potential trading partners can check the mailing address against the blacklist. I'm really not sure about the legal implications though. Perhaps a whitelist is a better option and that is exactly what the feedback system gives us. It's not perfect, I've seen 100% legitimate collectors getting bad feedback. It also makes it difficult for newer members to get a start which is something we should all be trying to assist with.
There isn't a perfect system, some people will go to any lenghts to make a fast buck. There is a guy right now selling "hammer job" coins on eBay as "die clash errors". He gets about ten bucks each - pathetic isn't it? Numista, despite the occassional dishonest visitor, has a great community, new collectors are welcomed instead of ridiculed, it's so refreshing after the drama and general bitchiness of most of the larger collector's website. (USCC is the only other place I feel entirely comfortable)
Just one thought that we seem to have overlooked in the discussion thus far. There ought to be an obligation to make sure you have made use of your profile page to make it clear to other members where your collecting interests lie. If you are only collecting US Morgan Dollars then please say so! It will save you a lot of frustration and save the other party a lot of wasted time.
Now I'm off to get the last of the Guinness from the beer fridge and dream of English barmaids.
Non illegitimis carborundum est. Excellent advice for all coins.
Make Numismatics Great Again!
To be true, I do never think in terms of indecent or even better unfair proposals.
Although gold, silver and/or 2 euro coins do have their own value, I wont hesitate to swap them. It's just a question of the deal.
The deal do not implicates a swap based on 1 coin for another, it implicates that both parts do feel okay with it.
I wonder if there is a way to have a rating of coins by how many people have them for swap? A way that would show on the swap page for quick referance ( maybe the 1-10 idea. if only one person has it for trade that would make it a 1, two to five people would make a 2 and so on).
I don't see how to trade fairly based on value, without exact grading. After all, Krause is full of coins that are priced at $100+ in UNC and under $1 in VF.
Sorry it has been a while on this topic. 0gramz I see your point but I had a swap that to me was for worthless coins and I got 7 Olympic 50p's out of it. We were in agreement. He had proposed the swap. Both coins were void of value in a way and we agreed through communication what we wanted.
Matt, I found 1 suffy in the wild NO others!
To continue...getting a swap is about something you both want. From this forum board...it seems like we need to try and make a few alterations on the swapping process or cataloguing with value. I guess having very few coins of super high value I don't get many people asking for silly swaps. If I decline a swap I just type a note to say that I'm not interested in their coins or they haven't got much that interests me. Maybe we could have some generic phrases that we could have next to the message text boxes?! Just to give people an idea...and to help with the language barrier.
), but when I'm asked to send several coins worth a few euros, and I'll get nothing interesting in return, that's where I draw the line.
