ID/Valuation Help Annam (?) large copper

Thank you in advance for your assistance in attributing this coin.  I do not believe the previous owner's attribution of “Annam 10 cash Thanh Thai 1889-1907”.  

The coin is copper or copper alloy (nonmagnetic), 35mm, and weighs approximately 11.2 grams.  

http://www.elfreeman2.com/e14/14e024o.jpg 

http://www.elfreeman2.com/e14/14e024r.jpg  

Happy New Year!  

Eugene

Hello 🤖

Without pictures, it will be very difficult for anyone to help you. Could you please post clear pictures of each side of your item?

Please note that this is an automatic message. Feel free to ignore if it is not relevant.

Hello,halfdisme! Happy New Year for you too!

Please,why do you say that you don't believe in the atribution of your coin to Annam?

I checked and the written legend is that of Annam indeed. The denomination can be ‘’10 van'' or a ‘’phan'' coin. I can't say for sure which is yours because one side of the copper coin is so coroded that I don't know if that side was originaly blank (as that of ‘’phan'' coins) or had 2 letters on it (as the ‘’10 van'' coins had).

Andi👋

Let me clarify my statement.  I do suspect it is Annam, but I believe that it is much older than the previous owner's attribution--centuries older.  Can you read the ruler's name?

I cannot see any markings on the reverse, but it has obviously been buried at some time.  

This is much larger than any 10 van or phan coin that I have owned, and the legend is much cruder.  It is probably a multiple phan coin.  

Regards, 

Eugene

Ah,OK,Eugene,if you already had in hands 10 van & phan coins,then you know better. By owning such coins,you had the possibility to compare their dimensions and those of your present coin. I had no other source of documentation than the KM ''World Coins'' where dimensions(weight,diam.) are not given for these Annam coins. So,not  possible to compare anything!

Sorry,I can't read chinese(?) letters to tell the king's name.🥺

Andi👋

You know,Eugene,I rechecked the KM cat. for other previous times and saw that since(perhaps even before this) the 17-th.century almost all Viet-Nam coins were (cast/crude) copper(sometimes,zinc) ones,with the same denomination of ''phan''. There are plenty of types,very close as design one to another,difference being the inscript(rulers' names). No coin has dimensions precised,so I may suppose that,through centuries,the same phan denomination varied in weight & diameter. As often happened with coins of many other countries. What do you say? Isn't it possible?

P.S.: All these many types of phan coins have(although old of centuries) quite low collectable values,of few usd. (in used condition).

Andi👋

I'm sorry Andi, but what documented wisdom have you actually brought in to the theme originally opened by the OP?

Scold me, as you like to do, but please be factual to the OP! Facts are lovely documented things, and not just brain bobbles.

Hello

seems to be a token (with 15 van value  ) as report here

can't find more information for now

May be you can send a message to the member who have made the picture

N#89943

Edit/and if you find other information please share it with us🙂