Władysław IV Waza as Tsar of Russia, or one more time about the problem with coins that may be attributed to 2 issuers simultaneously [solved]

Hello,

There were coins minted by Polish King Władysław IV Vasa when he was also a Tsar of Russia. Such coins were listed in Russian catalogues as Russian coins (Kleščinov-Grišin), in Polish catalogues - as Polish coins (Kopicki) with different logic...

On Numista, previously, they were listed also under both countries but later someone decided to move a part of coins from Polish to Russian category and this created a mess… Now it looks like this: 4 coins that were in Russian catalogue previously and the 2 coins of the same types with the headings in Polish and different referenses, while PLC catalogue still have one similar coin.

I'd propose to return these 2 coins back to Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth (with a correction of spelling of Moscow and links to each other):

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces96516.html

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces96517.html

This would be easier solution and would save a logic of Numista catalogues for Russian and PLC coins that were created according to national catalogues (Kleščinov-Grišin and Kopicki).

If someone think that it is unreasonable, then this coin shall be also removed from PLC catalog:

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces257531.html

And Russian Empire part of the catalog for such coins shall be adjusted with the same logic (by Kleščinov-Grišin, with similar headings and page structures), duplicates shall be removed, Kopicki numbers shall be added as a second reference only….

To me (even though I am a Poland/PLC collector), these are Russian types (Russian currency system) intended to circulate in Russia, even though they were struck in the name of Wladyslaw as tsar.  

Wladyslaw would not become king of Poland until 1632,  so it is a bit different than other discussions we have on where to  put coins struck on the authority of Polish kings (Stefan Batory, Sigismund III) while they also ruled in Grand Duchy of Lithuania, Livonia, etc. 

WIth this logic, the coins would stay in Russia, and we would move #257531 to be with the others, and eliminate any duplicates (for example, are the two listings for the gold kopecks duplicates?), and put the Kopicki references as secondary, as you suggest.

That said, because of the strong connection to Poland, and the high interest of Polish collectors in these coins (in part because the coins of Wladyslaw as king are all very rare), it would be good to make them equally visible to Poland collectors who look for them under Poland-Lithuania Commonwealth.  Maybe this looks like a sub-section under Poland-Lithuania Commonwealth “Grand Duchy of Moscow Ruble 1611-1612” which re-directs to Russian Empire?

These are Russian coins so they should be all within Russia - Empire issuer.

I think the best solution would be to allow 2 issuers for one coin. But in case this wouldn't be implemented, all the existing pages shall be updated under Russian wire coins catalogue standard

For the time being, I guess that would be better.

Was it done?

After they had been moved to Russian catalogue by someone, I've added the numbers from both catalogues to the coins' pages, made some other corrections and asked to remove duplicates that shall be the last correction.

Grinya

After they had been moved to Russian catalogue by someone, I've added the numbers from both catalogues to the coins' pages, made some other corrections and asked to remove duplicates that shall be the last correction.

Ok perfect so if nothing more is needed I close :-)